Thoughts on Vilecore

REoL · February 4th, 2001, 08:36 AM

I finished Vilecore. Wow. What a series! Here's my thoughts.

First off, when I started up this game in Ultra-Violence with my trusty PRBooM (last version made by TeamTNT themselves), I thought I was going to run into a lot of Arch Viles all the way through. I was wrong. That was good.
You DO see a lot of them, but not as I thought I would, but enough to make what was to be a really tough set of maps that I've played in awhile, that were doable.
At the start, it was fairly simple, like most maps usually are, and for a first realease, the archetecture was a little on the plain and ugly side at first, but as you progress through the maps, you see his improvements, and some are quite big.
I adapted to the monster placement quite well, and in my opinion, I thought it had that "REoL TOUGH" feel to it, as if it were my own, but it's not, and Doom_dude does make a lot of unigue puzzles and fighting scenarios as well, nevertheless, I could relate to the placement of everything, just about.
As mentioned, the archetecture got better along the way, as it was a little plain and sometimes ugly at first, but it became something to look at later on. There were some texture misallignments throughout the entire series, but none were all to bad, and frankly, some textures just can't be lined up anyway. Some were intentional, to hint of secret areas. Many were easy to spot, many were not. I managed to find at least one secret per map.
The battles at the bitter end of this map were something else. You better save and save often, especially where strategic planning is a must, like the Battle Hex (MAP30). The ending was brutal. I found myself cursing ugly 4-letter words a lot. Most maps took about 30 to 45 minutes to complete. This last one took about 90 minutes, but that's a guess, because I got "TIME SUCKS" for a time when I completed it.
Item placement was pretty good, sometimes a little much, sometimes WAY too much ammo and health. You don't hear me complaining about that, though, do you?

Some people actually DO complain. I think Doom_dude went for challenging battles rather than challengineg the art of ammo conservation. That's a plus in my book.

There are some bad points, though, and one being VERY bad, but let's start easy:

First, he SAID he made this map series for any engine, but with Legacy in mind. There are no Legacy specials, but you do have at least 1 dead-end if you use a non-jump port, like BooM. There was a shootable switch BooM couldn't reach, because of it's high placement. A lucky blast from the double-barrel shotgun can hit it, though, but it took several tries.
A somewhat bad thing was in order to gain a Red Key in another map, you had to jump onto an alcove to get it. BooM doesn't jump. I had to NOCLIP my way in and out of this area when getting said Red Key. Oopsie.

Antother annoying thing is that some lifts and doors are not obvious. Some have the same texture or likeness as it's surroundings, potentially confusing the player. If it's not secret, it shouldn't have look like one, especially the huge door section in Battle Hex (MAP30).
A BIG MISTAKE was in Battle Hex, you were REQUIRED to find a secret to continue the map. This is what designer tuts would consider, in one tut, "A very big No-No." A HUGE grade drop for that one.

All in all, for a first release, this is not a bad set of amps, and are really VERY good. As Doom_dude makes more maps, he'll learn from these mistakes and will become a better level deigner down the road. The archetecture is there, the gameplay is there, the design is there, it's these costly errors that can kill you.

I'll give this level set a B- for a grade. Some major flaws dropped what was an excellent experience down like a lead ballon, but it's Doom_dude's FIRST RELEASE, so I think he did very well!

If you like my REoL TOUGH maps, then no doubt you'll love Vilecore. Just remember to use an engine capable of jumping, okay?

------------------
King REoL

REoL TOUGH: Has it been 7 YEARS already?! Jesus Christ....
http://members.aol.com/georgef551/REoL_TOUGH.html

March 12th, 2002, 06:32 PM

Just moved this thing over here from Rants. Overall King REoL just couldn't actually say he liked it without saying it fell on its face like a lead balloon. LOL. Thanx REoL I actually enjoyed your review from way back. Sorry I didn't respond till now.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 12th, 2002, 06:53 PM

Wow, I can't believe you never responded to that one. Anyway, he has some good points. I'm surprised he didn't find the "push the switch from below and skip half the level" cheat. Nobody ever finds those. I haven't played Map30 yet so I can't comment on that. I mentioned all the things I found wrong before though. He's right that there are only a few flaws that take away from the gameplay (only cause you have to noclip). Vilecore 2 sounds like it's going to be loads of fun if it improves on this already kick-ass megawad!

Heh, why'd I just repeat so much of what I've already said???

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 12th, 2002, 07:22 PM

I didn't respond to it because it was around the time of him getting kicked and then I forgot about it. It didn't make sense to reply to the topic when he was gone. Anyhow Vilecore 2.0 is already better without a doubt.

Oh and he said one of the bad points of Vilecore was: There are no Legacy specials. I always said that it would have no special stuff and was a vanilla style Doom II megawad that would run under Legacy. He also said this: A somewhat bad thing was in order to gain a Red Key in another map, you had to jump onto an alcove to get it. Ummmm what red key in an alcove or is he talking about map32? Ugh, he must be.

Otherwise I agree with what he said. LOL.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 12th, 2002, 09:02 PM

Yeah, I think he was talking about that thing in Map32 (the one you fixed I hear). As for not having any Legacy specials, there's nothing wrong with that. Vilecore would still look like crap if you didn't play it in a port though (ports just look better these days.

Of course, if you were going to use special stuff, I would just stick to some of the new linedef stuff that was added in BooM. 99% of ports (and probably all the popular ones) are BooM compatible (Legacy for sure). Everyone has at least one of these ports. Of course, you'd have to keep a text file of these types open so you could enter the numbers in DoomCAD (assuming it even supports that). If someone made some kind of config file for DoomCAD, that would work too.

I don't even know why I bothered with all that. It would probably be a pain in the arse anyway.

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 12th, 2002, 10:19 PM

It would be a pain in the arse and id rather just do kewl stuff with textures and architecture. To tell ya the truth I'm not very interested in specials at all. I mean if I'm that horny to do that kind of editing I'll go edit some Half-Life or Hexen II. Meanwhile I'll make what I know works for me and when DooM III comes along then I'll be full throttle into room over room and other 3D engine stuff. Besides doomcad isn't compatible with this new fangled crap anyhow.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 12th, 2002, 10:39 PM

Whatever you do, I'm sure it will rock. You'll have to do a Vilecore mod for DooM III when that comes out too.

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 13th, 2002, 04:38 PM

Thanx Aliotroph? and when DooM III comes along I'll probably be doing a project like Vilecore thats a given. LOL.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 14th, 2002, 12:01 AM

I can't wait. I'm already thinking about the GeForce4 I'm probably going to buy (who the Hell needs a GeForce3 when the GeForce4's already sell for around $200.

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 17th, 2002, 07:21 AM

Thats what I need, a new video card. My 16mb Voodoo Banshee just showed its age with Red Faction methinks. Everything else including RTCW works great though. I see a good deal here in the store(s) and I'm going to get one of those geForce jobbies.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 18th, 2002, 11:25 AM

My GeForce II is a pretty sweet jobby, but I know it won't be able to pull the math necessary for DooM III. One of my friends claims the GeForce III's can outperform lots of the GeForce 4's. It's starting to sound like nVidia pulled an Intel with their new stuff. Maybe We'll all have to switch to AMB CPU's and Radeon cards instead.

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 18th, 2002, 01:27 PM

AMB? I have an AMD 850.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 18th, 2002, 10:54 PM

Man, the typos I make are silly. I just spent 30 min trying to reconfigure my internet crap with Telus to use my laptop on the net instead of my big box. I can only have two boxes on at once (my dad's laptop is on now) and I had to change the mac address so this one worked. It was a pain to do for some reason because it wonn't do it automatically.

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 19th, 2002, 07:24 AM

Whats funny is the B isn't that close to the D.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 19th, 2002, 09:37 AM

LOL Nevr thought of that!

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 19th, 2002, 10:16 AM

And nevr is spelt never.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 19th, 2002, 11:22 AM

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 21st, 2002, 07:28 PM

Uber Sodat

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 21st, 2002, 07:57 PM

Heh, bad typing is everyhwere! What have I done?!?!?

Sorry for not being here in two days. I couldn't get onto this site without getting some type of forbidden message. Apparentely onmy my little corner of the world had this problem too.

------------------
"Killed Aliotroph?"
- obituary from Perfect Dark

March 21st, 2002, 09:19 PM

Ummm you didn't do anything at all. I was just fighting them big dudes in RTCW....the super soldiers. LOL. Sorry I wasn't implying anything about your typing and my typing is full of mistakes, mostly in the lack of these ',' things.

You couldn't get on because the network was being moved to anouther server.

------------------

The Megawad: Home of Vilecore

All that glitters is not gold.
------------------------
Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

February 4th, 2001, 08:36 AM	#1
REoL Commander Keen Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Someplace that exists Posts: 3,586	Thoughts on Vilecore I finished Vilecore. Wow. What a series! Here's my thoughts. First off, when I started up this game in Ultra-Violence with my trusty PRBooM (last version made by TeamTNT themselves), I thought I was going to run into a lot of Arch Viles all the way through. I was wrong. That was good. You DO see a lot of them, but not as I thought I would, but enough to make what was to be a really tough set of maps that I've played in awhile, that were doable. At the start, it was fairly simple, like most maps usually are, and for a first realease, the archetecture was a little on the plain and ugly side at first, but as you progress through the maps, you see his improvements, and some are quite big. I adapted to the monster placement quite well, and in my opinion, I thought it had that "REoL TOUGH" feel to it, as if it were my own, but it's not, and Doom_dude does make a lot of unigue puzzles and fighting scenarios as well, nevertheless, I could relate to the placement of everything, just about. As mentioned, the archetecture got better along the way, as it was a little plain and sometimes ugly at first, but it became something to look at later on. There were some texture misallignments throughout the entire series, but none were all to bad, and frankly, some textures just can't be lined up anyway. Some were intentional, to hint of secret areas. Many were easy to spot, many were not. I managed to find at least one secret per map. The battles at the bitter end of this map were something else. You better save and save often, especially where strategic planning is a must, like the Battle Hex (MAP30). The ending was brutal. I found myself cursing ugly 4-letter words a lot. Most maps took about 30 to 45 minutes to complete. This last one took about 90 minutes, but that's a guess, because I got "TIME SUCKS" for a time when I completed it. Item placement was pretty good, sometimes a little much, sometimes WAY too much ammo and health. You don't hear me complaining about that, though, do you? Some people actually DO complain. I think Doom_dude went for challenging battles rather than challengineg the art of ammo conservation. That's a plus in my book. There are some bad points, though, and one being *VERY* bad, but let's start easy: First, he SAID he made this map series for any engine, but with Legacy in mind. There are no Legacy specials, but you do have at least 1 dead-end if you use a non-jump port, like BooM. There was a shootable switch BooM couldn't reach, because of it's high placement. A lucky blast from the double-barrel shotgun can hit it, though, but it took several tries. A somewhat bad thing was in order to gain a Red Key in another map, you had to jump onto an alcove to get it. BooM doesn't jump. I had to NOCLIP my way in and out of this area when getting said Red Key. Oopsie. Antother annoying thing is that some lifts and doors are not obvious. Some have the same texture or likeness as it's surroundings, potentially confusing the player. If it's not secret, it shouldn't have look like one, especially the huge door section in Battle Hex (MAP30). A BIG MISTAKE was in Battle Hex, you were REQUIRED to find a secret to continue the map. This is what designer tuts would consider, in one tut, "A very big No-No." A HUGE grade drop for that one. All in all, for a first release, this is not a bad set of amps, and are really VERY good. As Doom_dude makes more maps, he'll learn from these mistakes and will become a better level deigner down the road. The archetecture is there, the gameplay is there, the design is there, it's these costly errors that can kill you. I'll give this level set a B- for a grade. Some major flaws dropped what was an excellent experience down like a lead ballon, but it's Doom_dude's FIRST RELEASE, so I think he did very well! If you like my REoL TOUGH maps, then no doubt you'll love Vilecore. Just remember to use an engine capable of jumping, okay? ------------------ King REoL REoL TOUGH: Has it been 7 YEARS already?! Jesus Christ.... http://members.aol.com/georgef551/REoL_TOUGH.html

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March 12th, 2002, 06:32 PM	#2
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	Just moved this thing over here from Rants. Overall King REoL just couldn't actually say he liked it without saying it fell on its face like a lead balloon. LOL. Thanx REoL I actually enjoyed your review from way back. Sorry I didn't respond till now. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 12th, 2002, 06:53 PM	#3
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	Wow, I can't believe you never responded to that one. Anyway, he has some good points. I'm surprised he didn't find the "push the switch from below and skip half the level" cheat. Nobody ever finds those. I haven't played Map30 yet so I can't comment on that. I mentioned all the things I found wrong before though. He's right that there are only a few flaws that take away from the gameplay (only cause you have to noclip). Vilecore 2 sounds like it's going to be loads of fun if it improves on this already kick-ass megawad! Heh, why'd I just repeat so much of what I've already said??? ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 12th, 2002, 07:22 PM	#4
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	I didn't respond to it because it was around the time of him getting kicked and then I forgot about it. It didn't make sense to reply to the topic when he was gone. Anyhow Vilecore 2.0 is already better without a doubt. Oh and he said one of the bad points of Vilecore was: There are no Legacy specials. I always said that it would have no special stuff and was a vanilla style Doom II megawad that would run under Legacy. He also said this: A somewhat bad thing was in order to gain a Red Key in another map, you had to jump onto an alcove to get it. Ummmm what red key in an alcove or is he talking about map32? Ugh, he must be. Otherwise I agree with what he said. LOL. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 12th, 2002, 09:02 PM	#5
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	Yeah, I think he was talking about that thing in Map32 (the one you fixed I hear). As for not having any Legacy specials, there's nothing wrong with that. Vilecore would still look like crap if you didn't play it in a port though (ports just look better these days. Of course, if you were going to use special stuff, I would just stick to some of the new linedef stuff that was added in BooM. 99% of ports (and probably all the popular ones) are BooM compatible (Legacy for sure). Everyone has at least one of these ports. Of course, you'd have to keep a text file of these types open so you could enter the numbers in DoomCAD (assuming it even supports that). If someone made some kind of config file for DoomCAD, that would work too. I don't even know why I bothered with all that. It would probably be a pain in the arse anyway. ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 12th, 2002, 10:19 PM	#6
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	It would be a pain in the arse and id rather just do kewl stuff with textures and architecture. To tell ya the truth I'm not very interested in specials at all. I mean if I'm that horny to do that kind of editing I'll go edit some Half-Life or Hexen II. Meanwhile I'll make what I know works for me and when DooM III comes along then I'll be full throttle into room over room and other 3D engine stuff. Besides doomcad isn't compatible with this new fangled crap anyhow. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 12th, 2002, 10:39 PM	#7
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	Whatever you do, I'm sure it will rock. You'll have to do a Vilecore mod for DooM III when that comes out too. ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 13th, 2002, 04:38 PM	#8
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	Thanx Aliotroph? and when DooM III comes along I'll probably be doing a project like Vilecore thats a given. LOL. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 14th, 2002, 12:01 AM	#9
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	I can't wait. I'm already thinking about the GeForce4 I'm probably going to buy (who the Hell needs a GeForce3 when the GeForce4's already sell for around $200. ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 17th, 2002, 07:21 AM	#10
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	Thats what I need, a new video card. My 16mb Voodoo Banshee just showed its age with Red Faction methinks. Everything else including RTCW works great though. I see a good deal here in the store(s) and I'm going to get one of those geForce jobbies. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 18th, 2002, 11:25 AM	#11
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	My GeForce II is a pretty sweet jobby, but I know it won't be able to pull the math necessary for DooM III. One of my friends claims the GeForce III's can outperform lots of the GeForce 4's. It's starting to sound like nVidia pulled an Intel with their new stuff. Maybe We'll all have to switch to AMB CPU's and Radeon cards instead. ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 18th, 2002, 01:27 PM	#12
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	AMB? I have an AMD 850. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 18th, 2002, 10:54 PM	#13
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	Man, the typos I make are silly. I just spent 30 min trying to reconfigure my internet crap with Telus to use my laptop on the net instead of my big box. I can only have two boxes on at once (my dad's laptop is on now) and I had to change the mac address so this one worked. It was a pain to do for some reason because it wonn't do it automatically. ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 19th, 2002, 07:24 AM	#14
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	Whats funny is the B isn't that close to the D. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 19th, 2002, 09:37 AM	#15
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	LOL Nevr thought of that! ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 19th, 2002, 10:16 AM	#16
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	And nevr is spelt never. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 19th, 2002, 11:22 AM	#17
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 21st, 2002, 07:28 PM	#18
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	Uber Sodat ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

March 21st, 2002, 07:57 PM	#19
Aliotroph? Guest Posts: n/a	Heh, bad typing is everyhwere! What have I done?!?!? Sorry for not being here in two days. I couldn't get onto this site without getting some type of forbidden message. Apparentely onmy my little corner of the world had this problem too. ------------------ "Killed Aliotroph?" - obituary from Perfect Dark

March 21st, 2002, 09:19 PM	#20
Doom_Dude Guest Posts: n/a	Ummm you didn't do anything at all. I was just fighting them big dudes in RTCW....the super soldiers. LOL. Sorry I wasn't implying anything about your typing and my typing is full of mistakes, mostly in the lack of these ',' things. You couldn't get on because the network was being moved to anouther server. ------------------ The Megawad: Home of Vilecore All that glitters is not gold. ------------------------ Sometimes it's not easy following the path of least resistance.

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