Okay.

[ace]

Let me finish gameplay/DM/coop tweaking, and I'll upload the 99% finished product for all tomorrow.

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/7365/map09finallydoneit3.png

And it just so happens that in Ace-time, it's finally tomorrow, yippee! Alright, alright, seriously, so I pulled a Doom Dude (/me snickers). My fault, honestly. :p

In all seriousness though. The map is officially, finally, 99.99% complete. And as such, while I still do not believe it is ready for upload to the site, it is almost entirely done in every way possible. And lookit that, I'm only two whole months late. Heh.

But anyway. DOWNLOAD:

CLICKY (http://rapidshare.de/files/35642279/Map09.zip.html)


All skills are completely done and tweaked quite extensively. HMP has been toned down quite a bit (though it still won't be a walk in the park at least), ITYTD is (in comparison to the other skills anyhoo) child's play, and UV is the olde version of HMP with tiny tweaks here and there. You'll be in for a fight in UV, that's for sure! ;)

The DM section is also finished, though to be honest I feel as if I sort of threw it together. In all honesty, while I get the basic idea for single player gameplay, I nearly never multiplay, and as such do not have the best idea for balanced DMing. However, I think what I have set up at the moment may suffice well enough, and I tried to keep all the item placements varied balanced and such.

And last, a few problems I've encountered:


I've noticed that in certain ports, one of the turbo doors by the first elevator after you have the blue key doesn't open. I have no idea what causes this; the line's facing the right way, the right flags are set, and it works in most ports, just not one or two (I cannot recall ATM if PrBoom(+) is included).

The caverns section is heavily based on activating switches to gain access to new areas which are blocked off. Because this is the only area for DM, there are chances that at the start not all areas will be accessible. Because you get taken to a random DM start after death, it's not as big a deal because from then on you may end up in the first area and be able to open the rest of them from then on. Until then however players would be stuck to one section. Not my biggest concern ATM though.

The music doesn't really fit with the map really well, mainly because it's so non-theme based and generic of a custom map. I've been looking through various MIDs from various sources, but have yet to find anyt hat fit well. I'll continue seraching, but in the meantime, if anyone has a place where there are some good Doom-ish MIDs or knows of any specific song that would fit better it'd be appreciated. ;)

Due to the lack of a functioning modified Dead Lost Soul thing via DeHackEd, the chasm still doesn't kill players/monsters who fall into it. I have tried a few times but still don't understand DeHackEd for shit, let alone anywhere close enough as is necessary to be able to change the thing as planned before. If you dunno what I'm referring to (I only remembered myself when I spent an hour digging up that quote of myself, what I time-waster I be :p) check these (http://forums.newdoom.com/showthread.php?t=30729) threads (http://forums.newdoom.com/showthread.php?t=30779&page=5).


Because of these problems the map remains 99.99%. Technically speaking, problem one could be considered a bug that would just need squishing starting around December, but the music and DeHackEd thing aren't so in order to get things working right along I would like getting those worked out. But anyhoo, tell me what you think of the map! Any comments/critiquing is highly appreciated, especially on DM and Coop, seeing as they're untested (plus Coop only contains player starts and not any modifications to monster/item placement).

Well, now that I've finished another very long-winded post... *flies away*

[Logan MTM]

HMMMmmmmmmm!!! *cool*
Now, my Map08 need of a new End! *knownot*

[ace]

No need to worry too much about making a big deal for an ending. Since the map's a teleporter start the most you'd have to do is add a teleporter exit.

But any critiquing, anyone? Anyone, anyone? Bueller? :p

[Dutch Devil]

Alright since everybody else is too lazy to try out your map I'm going to download it and play it for an while.
Haven't been too busy with mapping lately anyway, ill try my best to get you good feedback :)

[edit]Why do I have to wait 60 fucking seconds to download your map argh.
[edit2]I can't download your map I'm getting some javascript error I tried three times, can you email the map to me.

[ace]

If I knew your email address I would, now wouldn't I? :p

However you might have Java blocked somehow too. I recently got the NoScript extension for FireFox and by default it blocks Javascript from any and all websites until you say otherwise, and as a result I got that error for RS before I disabled it for the site.

[Logan MTM]

No need to worry too much about making a big deal for an ending. Since the map's a teleporter start the most you'd have to do is add a teleporter exit.
So be it! *thumbs*

[Dutch Devil]

Ok did played your map on UV and it wasn't too hard but certaintly not easy as well I was struggeling at the first part when I had to fight off revs not my favourite monster to deal with I suck at escaping those rockets.I had to save an couple of times and I died a few times as well, there was plenty of ammo and health lying around there was never any shortage of it and I think there is too much of both.Especially the cave area was very easy a lot of infighting between monsters I think its better to let those monsters teleport in, at one time I just stood in front of the bars and let the baddies do the dirty work for me the cave looked pretty cool the entire map did impress me there is just tons of detail no area seemed boring but some areas might have been an bit overdetailed to the point it got in the way of gameplay.The shotgun at the start is not neccesary cause you get one just after you go through the first door and get shot in your ass by two sargeants nice litte trap keep it :p

If I can find more things ill let you know gonna play it some more on other ports.
[edit]Legacy doesn't like your map very much and I got some unclosed sectors while checking for bugs in db.

[ace]

Thanks for the feedback. :)

The detailing didn't really get in the way of motivation for gameplay, because I did them so far apart. However, I admit that I seemed to have half-arsed one or two parts, and there are a few points (the yellow key access area in particular) that have too much ammunition. I also completely half-assed it with the health because it's the same on all difficulty levels. So I'll probably continue to tweak item placement skill by skill (ammo mainly in UV, because it seems that those aren't as big of a problem in the other skills IIRC; health in all of course) until it's better.

The cave area does have a bit of a problem with infighting as well. I considered at one point using teleportation, but I think I figured it'd be more of a challenge with just an all-out fight right from the get-go. On the same note, however, I don't mind the infighting so much and have actually used it in that area in some points (with the mancubi and arachnotrons in particular). I'll tweak it a bit, though, but not too much because I think it's not so bad (not counting the ammo).

In fact, methinks I will go through on each skill a few times, take note of which items (if any) on average are left over, and remove most (if not all) of them. Make things more interesting, hopefully.

And gweh, you like it when you're short on ammo? I mean, I wasn't trying to give the player an excess amount but... blargh. :p


Also if anyone gets the chance I'd like to know how well the DM is balanced. Coop I'm not so worried about; in fact, I think I'm going to leave the item/monster placement the same as single player for coop, because that way the players have to be more careful with evenly dividing who picks up what ammo/health, thus having to be more cautious.

[Dutch Devil]

Nah I like an decent amounts of ammo and health maybe use fewer types of monsters in the caves this will lower infighting as well me thinks.I kinda missed an boss at the end guarding the exit :) an cyber might be cool on UV at the end.Why is there an soulsphere secret close to the exit is the next map going to be very hard from the start?I played your map with risen3d on skill 3 and it was an bit too easy imo, and the monsters at the blue key room don't teleport fast enough this trap could be harder wasn't really stuggeling here.

Keep up the good work Ace.

[ace]

Actually I've been thinking of changing the soulsphere at the end secret to something else. I just put it there as summat a reward I guess (or for those who suck really bad and ended up with <30 health at the end :p). But it's gotten to a point where it's just a little much.

The blue key area ambush seems to be nearly random with the teleporting times. Sometimes they all come soon, and sometimes there's a few who lag behind for eternity. I tried playing with it and usually they come in at a good enough pace now, though they don't always seem to do this, no matter how I've changed it.

Obviously HMP isn't that hard considering the challenge UV supplies. However I'll up the antsy in a few places, because indeed it seems I took out some things I don't think I should have. ITYTD will stay as-is though, because anyone looking for a wimpy fight deserves to find one (though I did take out half the ammo due to the amounts being double). :p

A cyberdemon seems somewhat overkill for the ending though, IMO... though it does seem anticlimatic that I set up a large pack of large monsters at the front and middle and then left a pack of imps and a few kazimodemons at the end. I'll think of something.

Thanks again for all the feedback, too. It coitanly helps. :)

[DooMAD]

Boom's scrolling floors will help with teleporter slowness, I used them in my map. Just have 4 sectors that scroll around in a circle and make the connecting linedefs teleport monsters:

http://www.teamhellspawn.com/teleportscroll.gif

The four linedefs highlighted in yellow are the teleport linedefs, you can also tag the other double-sided lines if you want. The thin sector is just a raised platform to lower when you want them to spawn in. It's a little more complicated than conventional monster teleports, but works quite nicely. They just get pushed round until everything has teleported in. You might have to tweak the scrolling speed (defined by the linedef length) a bit to make it just right. Mine is 192, but it might be different depending on how large you make it.

[Dutch Devil]

A door refuses to open (sector 429) while playing with Risen3d its caused by linedef 1880 being to close to the door, I got stuck there and had to idclip through.

[ace]

Yeah, that was the bug I mentioned in the first post as one of the known issues. So it's caused by line 1880 being too close to the door? Hrm, well I'll move the door a little further out I guess then.

I'll check out the scrolling floors thing for teleporting too. I might not use it on the blue key room since that one's already been tweaked to go at a certain speed, but there are other spots with group teleportings that take a little long that might need fixing...

[Dutch Devil]

Yeah linedef 1880 is the suspect in this case, I had these problems as well back then I couldn't get an teleporter working altough I had set it up the right way reason for that was an other linedef with some other linedef action being too close to my teleporter linedef.

The door worked fine in Gzdoom if I remember correctly.

[Agent Spork]

Hey ace, do you think I might be able to take a look at the map? Rapidshare doesn't seem to like that WAD at all, and as such I can't download it. If you send it to me I'd be willing to put it on web space that is a little bit more permanent and/or functional.

My e-mail address is AgentSporK@<remove this lol>gmail.com

[MR_ROCKET]

I was able to download it off rapidshare this time around using the 2nd mirror they had over there, but yeah I agree the rapidshare thing is kinda iffy.
Anyways, Very cool map. I especially like the big underground area and those bastard second pair of revenants gave me a beating right off the bat lol, But nice map man, I think it's a good intro for the next underground beginning?. And I dig the piston switches.:P
Noticed a small railing texture mis-alignment at the jagged bridge area, which is minor, same with my map, noticed a few texture things I need to fix argh. But thats ok :D, I have yet to plug some more things into it as well, just glad everything else is done. but enough about my stuff :D
Good map Ace ;) I'll have to play it again without saving game this time heh

[ace]

Fixed the bridge alignment problem and another alignment problem that was pointed out to me. Thanks for the help! ;)

And I shall send the map to you, Sporky. An even less buggy one considering that I've fixed some of the stuff mentioned here already. Though I do need to turn lazy mode off and tweak the item placement some more... heh.