Do you think...?

[ace]

Do you think that, whether soon or after a while, that once NDCP is done there will eventually be a NDCP2? Or has the first one been too exasperatingly time-consuming and belated to consider it? I think it'd be nice to have a second one sooner or later, perhaps mapped by some of the newer members. What do you think?

[DOOM_GOAT]

There are probably enough abandoned half way, pulled for no reason or author-swallowed-by-a-black-hole maps floating about to make another three.

[iori]

Considering this one has taken... three years at least I don't think so.

[Xtife]

you guys should keep focusing on finishing the first :)
if i had known that it would take 3 years to complete, i would have put some time limits in place
i was way to soft :) DD is doing a much better job keeping this together

[DooMAD]

There's always this: http://forums.newdoom.com/showthread.php?t=20797

[FATAL]

Do you think...?
No I don't never.

[Aliotroph?]

you guys should keep focusing on finishing the first :)
if i had known that it would take 3 years to complete, i would have put some time limits in place
i was way to soft :) DD is doing a much better job keeping this together

That works for contests. We've had something like five time limits and it won't work. It needs to get done and can't really be left without 32 maps. People keep disappearing though and some of the people who submitted maps have actually been banned.

[Doom_Dude]

iori can be the lead monkey on the next one. I'm gonna hide in an editing hole.

[Aliotroph?]

The time we've taken on this is almost the length of time taken to make Oblivion!!! :D By the time we pull another one together there'll be a firth Elder Scrolls game! :p

[ace]

If there would be a second one I would want to participate... I've never taken part in a community project and it sounds fun. It's just too bad that most of you think there won't be one because it's too time consuming. I guess when I think about it it's true, alot of people abandoned it or disappeared or never finished it, and if that happens again then there's not a very good chance of it.

However, considering that we're getting more and more faces showing up here that have AFAICS a pretty good mapping ability, we could if we're lucky find enough people, possibly make a second one. That is as long as we find either 32 new mappers that are skilled/dedicated enough (which would include myself should there be a second one), or 32 older ones, or a combination of both, and if we would have to have some to take up more than one slot.

So basically the chance of getting another one off the ground aren't high, unless we could find enough new people that are talented enough in detail and gameplay for plain old D2.exe. But there's always hoping... right?

[Doom_Dude]

LOL@Oblivion

I think time will tell if a 2nd one is to be made. Right now all I want is to get this one done and then work on my own junk. I certainly wouldn't want to be a project lead on anouther 32 level megawad anytime soon unless I started the project myself. I think if I lead anouther it will be smaller and......

*runs off to get a beer*

[iori]

Deadlines work if they are enforced (with certain checkpoints along the way to make sure everyone is up to snuff). Community Chest 2 for example was only a matter of weeks/months late, not years.

[Xtife]

agreed
both CC projects did so well with that

[rustyslacker]

i hope there's another. by the time this one's done and the next one's started, my maps will be good enough to be in a megawad.

[Aliotroph?]

lol I'm not sure whether that's supposed to say something good about your improvement or something bad about our timing.

[rustyslacker]

both :-D
this message needs one more character to be posted.

[CrazedImp]

If a second one does go ahead i could probably contribute a map or two... sure my mapping skills arent as incredible as some peoples around here but they'll get better if im actually working to not just benefit my own entertainment.

[Aliotroph?]

Heh, there's a new mapping contest in the editing forum. They want more mappers. Go there. :)

[CrazedImp]

Yes i know that, but im too busy with real life stuff at the moment to go and do it ;)

[Danimetal]

Maybe it´s time to bump the whole NDCP thing :P?.
I would be into another effort, of course. I have nothing better to do now XD!.

[CrazedImp]

Hmmm... nah i think there could be an NDCP2, or a new megawad project where only not very experienced mappers can contribute... you know, a bunch of levels that arent of highest quality but still fun to play, like a beginners map pack or something... it'd be a good way to see if any of the new people round here might show promising talent or something like that

[ace]

Hmmm... nah i think there could be an NDCP2, or a new megawad project where only not very experienced mappers can contribute... you know, a bunch of levels that arent of highest quality but still fun to play, like a beginners map pack or something... it'd be a good way to see if any of the new people round here might show promising talent or something like that

I don't think that would be very popular. It would be good for the new mappers but not good for the people who play it. I think it'd be better to just have a new community project, where the new folk could join in as well. You think about it, not a lot of the old people may want to contribute and not a lot would be able to, but the ones who weren't in on the first one and/or weren't here for the first one starting would probably want in.

[CrazedImp]

Nah i didnt think it would be that popular an idea... maybe you should start another poll asking if somebody would actually contribute to a new NDCP? Im sure many people have faith that another one can actually get made, but it'd be nice to know how many people would be keen to help out.

[rustyslacker]

i would contribute to a new NDCP. but i was the only one who voted for "Yeah, sure!"

[CrazedImp]

Well since you have such enthusiasm you can lead the project if there is another one, if of course other people here are fine with it.

No i am not being sarcastic either ;)

[ace]

Hey, it was MY idea! :p

Hm... who WOULD be in on this, I wonder? Me for sure, of course.

[Doom_Dude]

If I was to lead anouther NDCP or other Doom editing project I would have to set down some rules beforehand to ensure that I don't have to chase people to find out if they went into the Bermuda Triangle or something, plus some other basic rules.

[edit] I see ace wants to do it. Have fun!

/jumps out the window and hides in the bushes. ;)

[rustyslacker]

i'd help out ace. i bet it would be a lot of fun XD

seriously, i would definitely contribute a map or two.

[ace]

[edit] I see ace wants to do it. Have fun!

/jumps out the window and hides in the bushes. ;)

Hey now... *pulls D_D back in through window*

Leading a community project sounds fun, but I have no experience of doing it. Any "pointers"? ;)

i'd help out ace. i bet it would be a lot of fun XD

seriously, i would definitely contribute a map or two.

Nice!

NDCP2... it just sounds so cool. :p

[Aliotroph?]

Pointers? Ask Double D once he brushes the bush dust off. He looked like he had something to say on the matter. :D

[rustyslacker]

WOW AWESOME!!!

but get this NDCP done before another is spawned.

[Doom_Dude]

WOW AWESOME!!!

but get this NDCP done before another is spawned. Yeah exactly.

Pointers? Ask Double D once he brushes the bush dust off. He looked like he had something to say on the matter. :D Well this is some of the crap I was going to say but I didn't get it finished. This is just my take on things..... Some are rules and some rants with suggestions to mappers n stuff. Overall I think that the NDCP has taken so long because of time wasted.

- Don't allow anybody, no matter what to take up more than 1 slot at a time. This was a problem from the NDCP's start and at least six slots were taken up and those maps were never made. This took up Months of wasted time when somebody else could've been actually working on something. Not to point fingers, as I also had 2 map slots at the start and I gave one up later on. So somebody takin' a bunch of slots and then doing nothing is only unintentionally hurting your project. Don't allow it and say so in the rules right away.

- Think about and write down the rules and get them sorted before even mentioning your intentions of starting an editing project. That way people know WTF is going on and you won't have to add / change too many rules later that make people confused. :p

- This bit is kinda hard but... I can't speak for anybody else but I don't like having to chase anybody down, beyond an email or PM or two.... Been there, done that and it sucks when you get NO ANSWER and then you don't know why. It's no fun trying to find somebody who disappears, doesn't ever post on the projects forum and thier email isn't answered because they switched addresses and never told you and they don't look at thier PM's on two forums for Months. If somebody goes missing for a Month.... cut them and get somebody else to do the job. They can always come back if a slot opens up and if they know beforehand that they will be dropped by being absent, then that's thier problem. How hard is it to send the leader an email, a PM or post a little message on a forum to let everybody know what your intentions are. Your supposed to be a part of a Team, not a member of the witness protection program. One Month with no show and it's bye-bye time. I don't like having to mafia somebodys ass but really...

- If you can't fin your map for whatever reason.... let the leader know so somebody else can take up the reins and start working.

- For God's sakes. If your a busy person and you have a lot going on in RL with a 1% chance of making a map in a decade, let alone a year, then please don't bother to join a mapping project. It's not fair to take up space and not do anything for Months. Thats time that somebody else could be working on the map you only intend to work on.

- If you plan on using custom skies, at the very least get 3 decent skies together before starting and post them up... or get everybody to decide what ones are best and then go from there. That way your not in the middle of getting the project done and suddenly start trying to get some new skies. Otherwise somebody might end up with a sky change they don't like. It would also be a good idea to have a nice custom texture wad with a good variety of textures from the start. We have one for the NDCP but it could've used more work from the get-go.

- So I think early preperation is important. Get rules sorted out and get textures prepared and think about what you want to do before even mentioning your project. So if somebody wants to know if custom sounds are allowed, then they will see you already said they aren't allowed in the rules or at least you'll know the answer and won't be wondering if you should or not. Will there be a theme? Will the project be for a source port? Remember that some people are crazy and will want to do weird shit like use Slige as a base for thier level. :p

- Don't ever think that a leader can tell you when a fat 32 level project will be done. It could take a year or five years. It shouldn't, in theory take more than a year but it's too hard to predict. Thats why deadlines suck.

Thats all I can think of for now. I might start a new editing projectile when the NDCP is done but it might be something different... Dunno right now. NDCP II: BloodCore? :p

[Xtife]

whoa DD *laff*
i totaly agree with ya on all of it
it was kinda of a rush in the beginning and i/we didnt think alot of things through
but you guys could have said something tho :p

good job

[ace]

{Insert huge list of stuff here}

Whoa. Good list you got there. If rules were strictly followed a new NDCP could (note I said COULD, a project leader should never give a "surefire" release date :p) be done in 2 years. It's too bad they usually aren't...

...but, having a new NDCP might be good! Though it would probably be best to wait until next year, maybe a month or two in, give it a break for a while. After all like Rusty said, wait until this one's done, and I think that a few extra months on top of that wouldn't hurt.

NDCP2... it just sounds awesome. :D

[Doom_Dude]

whoa DD *laff*
i totaly agree with ya on all of it
it was kinda of a rush in the beginning and i/we didnt think alot of things through
but you guys could have said something tho :p

good job I couldn't say anything because I didn't know any of this stuff before. ;)

Whoa. Good list you got there. If rules were strictly followed a new NDCP could (note I said COULD, a project leader should never give a "surefire" release date :p) be done in 2 years. It's too bad they usually aren't...

...but, having a new NDCP might be good! Though it would probably be best to wait until next year, maybe a month or two in, give it a break for a while. After all like Rusty said, wait until this one's done, and I think that a few extra months on top of that wouldn't hurt.

NDCP2... it just sounds awesome. :D I did go on a mini-rant or something. Some probably think I'm crazy... oh well. :p I'm sure a new NDCP will happen tho. :D

[iori]

I can see another one getting started, but I'm not so sure about the finishing part.

Awesome rant too DD. Sentiments duly echoed </toxicfluff>

[ace]

I can see another one getting started, but I'm not so sure about the finishing part.

Hey, the first is going to be finished, isn't it? I mean, it's taken too long, but it DID get finished... ;)

[iori]

Yes, but there was huge support for the first at the beginning, which slowly dwindled. Judging by the mixed bag of votes, I would suggest maybe an NDCP Episode to start out with (9 - 12 maps or so).

[rustyslacker]

well...so far there's medium support for an "NDCP2" and probably little at the end.

[Doom_Dude]

Yes, but there was huge support for the first at the beginning, which slowly dwindled. Judging by the mixed bag of votes, I would suggest maybe an NDCP Episode to start out with (9 - 12 maps or so). That was anouther thing I was going to mention and a good point iori. No reason a Doom project has to be 32 maps. Plan for 9-12 and if you get 15 (or whatever) then thats +3 bonus. ;)

[ace]

We'll see how it turns out. But starting out with a smaller amount of maps might not be a bad idea.

And a plus to that is we could keep slots open AFTER the release for a few months, and if at least 3 maps are made within that time it could be like an update, like NDCP 2.3.1 or whatever, if it could possibly work out.

[Xtife]

well im still with ya guys :) im checking up anyways hehe

[rustyslacker]

that sounds cool. i think we should only let people take up one slot at at time. if they are doing three maps, and then get abducted by aliens, then we have a gaping hole.

good stuff, doom_dude. thanks for telling us now, instead of letting us learn it as we go along.

[FATAL]

that sounds cool. i think we should only let people take up one slot at at time. if they are doing three maps, and then get abducted by aliens, then we have a gaping hole.

good stuff, doom_dude. thanks for telling us now, instead of letting us learn it as we go along.


sorry

[Doom_Dude]

Why did you repeat that?

[FATAL]

Heh, I felt like making a lame joke of saying the thing he said twice one more time.


sorry

[Doom_Dude]

Meh...........

[iori]

*runs naked through the thread*

[rustyslacker]

@iori: *chuck*

[Doom_Dude]

He's been streaking around newdoom since Picard was still at the Academy. :p

[CrazedImp]

I wonder if these naked rampages happen often... i am just a little frightened now *chuck*

[FATAL]

You shouldn't be frightened about that. You should be frightened about me being one of the most active posters around here.

[rustyslacker]

why should we be frightened about that???

[CrazedImp]

I dunno i posted it last night and i was half asleep... i must remind myself to just not post unless im awake...

[Flame Spawn]

I'm interested in this, but here's my question.

What engines are we allowed to use? I'm only good with ZDoom.

[Xtife]

to make maps, vanilla doom
to play them, use a limit removing port

[Aliotroph?]

Too bad all the major ports never implemented the BooM linedefs. Having a few of those in would have been nice.

[iori]

Every port except doomsday I believe. Boom is widely regarded as the standard, and has been for a while.

[rustyslacker]

did doomsday put in more lindef types to replace/improve the boom ones?

[Flame Spawn]

I heard that it's going to be the new version with Boom support. I think...

[Xtife]

the big part of this project, was to make it compatible with everything
if all ports had boom support back then, would have been able to use boom

[iori]

If I do any more community project mapping, it will be for nothing less than boom. I did have the opportunity to do some neat doom2 tricks in the NDCP, but Boom is the standard now.

[Doom_Dude]

I can agree with that. Some of those Boom jobbys are cool. I like using the scrolling floors. I put some of those in Stalking Evil with stuff like Lava flowing under a rock wall....

[FATAL]

Sounds cool. I hope that the new jdoom version will support boom.

[Doom_Dude]

Does anybody know what happened to PumpkinSmasher?

[Falci]

Do you think that, whether soon or after a while, that once NDCP is done there will eventually be a NDCP2? Or has the first one been too exasperatingly time-consuming and belated to consider it? I think it'd be nice to have a second one sooner or later, perhaps mapped by some of the newer members. What do you think?


I think I want to be in if there's ever a sequel to NDCP. I want to make at least 2 maps. *thumbs*

[ace]

Does anybody know what happened to PumpkinSmasher?

That's a good question actually... haven't seen him since his release of "OMG! Not Another Map by PuMpkInSmaShEr!" :/

I think I want to be in if there's ever a sequel to NDCP. I want to make at least 2 maps. *thumbs*

It's nice to see that more people think there could be a sequel than the initial post... but waiting a while would be best. After all, need to get this one done first.

[rustyslacker]

i know pumpkinsmasher has lurked a bit since then, but i haven't seen him on or anything for about a month.....

[Doom_Dude]

Well I sent him the Conglom wad on August 24 and his last post was on September 6th. I've not heard if he got the map or what.

[ace]

Speak of the devil, he posted in that "New Vilecore 2 shots" thread just over an hour ago...

... nice shots by the way. :p

[Doom_Dude]

Thanks.

Ermm that was yesterday....

[ace]

And I posted that yesterday. :p

[Doom_Dude]

and soon it'll be tomorrow. :p

[Flame Spawn]

In 3 hours and 14 minutes (CDT) thereabouts.

[rustyslacker]

So...what now? Is this "project" still on or what? Somebody give me feedback. Because if you don't I'll forget about it and Ace will have to lead this thing all by his lonesome...;)

[Doom_Dude]

The NDCP 2? I can't answer that. :p

[ace]

Um. I... um. Um? Um. No? Yes? No. Maybe? What? Shut up. Huh? :p



I dunno. If anything, we should prolly wait at least a good couple of months before because I'm sure that whoever worked on 1 that would like to map for 2 probably would like a break and not be perpetually mapping for NDCP. Plus it would be too soon anyway.

But. I suppose it could still be on perhaps.

[rustyslacker]

Yeah, NDCP 2. And it needs a title, like:

NDCP 2: War of Flaming Sheep-heads

or

NDCP 2: The Community Map Project with No Subtitle

[ace]

NDCP: First it Was NDCP and Now it's a More Different NDCP!

:p

[rustyslacker]

We're gonna need a new forum sometime in 2006. w00t! I can't wait.

[PumpkinSmasher]

Wasn't there talk of making NDCP2 for Legacy. And then use scripting so we could have as many maps as we wanted. Just thought I'd throw that back out here, or there.

[ace]

Yeh, I believe it was something like NDCP Legacy, not a sequel but rather an enhanced Legacy version of the current NDCP. I'm not sure but I think that's what it was.

[Aliotroph?]

But I designed my stuff carefully because I couldn't use Legacy. If it was reworked to use Legacy it might be a mess. :p

[DooMAD]

Wasn't there talk of making NDCP2 for Legacy. And then use scripting so we could have as many maps as we wanted. Just thought I'd throw that back out here, or there.
Yes, I posted a link to it on the first page of this thread:

There's always this: http://forums.newdoom.com/showthread.php?t=20797

I still have the DM map I was going to submit for it.

[Doom_Dude]

Yeh, I believe it was something like NDCP Legacy, not a sequel but rather an enhanced Legacy version of the current NDCP. I'm not sure but I think that's what it was. I certainly don't remember it being planned as an enhanced version of the current NDCP. If so, have fun finding Grunt, Stphrz and DoomedAce and me...

*runs away screaming*

I think I don't want to think about anouther project until the current one is finished. *shocked*

[Aliotroph?]

Man, it scares me that this thing is so olde Stphrz has a map in it!

[Doom_Dude]

Man, it scares me that this thing is so olde Stphrz has a map in it! I wish he was around and was into making more maps. I liked playing the few he did make. :)

[PumpkinSmasher]

What ever happened to DoomedAce?

[ace]

Wasn't it something like he was going to go on vacation but he disappeared after? I could swear he said something about starting to lack interest in Dooming. I hate it when that happens...

[Doom_Dude]

Yeah I have a feeling he won't be coming back. :/

[Aliotroph?]

I've never played one of Stphrz's maps. Anyone got a link to one?

[Nuxius]

Shock 'Em Down
http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=11203

Fiffy Remix
http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=11035

HAR
http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=10394

Pink Munchers And Pesky Imps (And The Occaisional Cacodemon Or Baron)
http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=10389

[Doom_Dude]

Nuxius beat me to it. :)

[PumpkinSmasher]

Well my vote is for NDCP Legacy, not a Legacy version of NDCP but a whole new community project for Legacy. But we should probably wait for 2.0 before doing that.

[ace]

That wouldn't be a bad idea. It would be a nice break from ZDooming for me. But I agree, waiting for 2.0 would be best. Sounds cool though... :D

[The Undertaker]

Don't worry, Legacy 3 will be out by the time your done with this one.

[Doom_Dude]

Don't worry, Legacy 3 will be out by the time your done with this one. Legacy 3 is going to be out before Christmas Eve?

[Aliotroph?]

Yeah, it's called GZDoom. ;)

[ace]

Methinks he was referring to NDCP 2. ;)

Which is a good point, if this one were to be Legacy-specific and took too long then there would probably be a new version with a lot of new features before this one were to be finished. :p

I hope it wouldn't take long again.

[FATAL]

Well NDCP was a rookie project - it was started before I joined the forums. *bliss*

[Doom_Dude]

Methinks he was referring to NDCP 2. ;) Ahhh of course. We still talking about that? NDCP 2. I think we should do anouther project, but keep it smaller and for Legacy. Maybe TL3DFEM... The Legacy 3D Floor Extravaganza Megawad. *drinky* Time to write up some strict rules. :p

[ace]

Well that depends when 2.0 comes out now doesn't it? To be honest I haven't been keeping up with news on Legacy as of late... :p

Of course though yeah, before another would start I think the following things should happen:

1) Legacy 2.0
2) A BREAK (hey, you don't want NDCP 1 mappers (should they join a second) to be doing this nonstop, do ya? They deserve a relax :p)
3) Rules (obviously)

Yeh.

[Doom_Dude]

Yeah of course.

I'll probably be making up some kind of alternative editing project jobby once this NDCP thing is out the window. I have some ideas but it won't be anouther 32 map jobby... I don't think, because that's just insanity. I also don't really feel like calling it NDCP2... but if somebody else wanted to do that, by all means. :p

[DooMAD]

I also don't really feel like calling it NDCP2

The name NDLW, or New Doom Legacy Wad, was floating around before, but then it is quite similar. It was divided into 20 single player maps and 10 deathmatch ones, or something like that. We can always cut down the number of maps if we don't get enough people. The deathmatch idea is a pretty good one considering that 2.0 is intended to have all new netcode.

[Doom_Dude]

I forgot about that NDLW title. ;)

You guys can do 30 maps if you want to. :p

I mapped all day yesterday and my brain is tired now so I gotta go and....plus I got news to do and a level to finish. *zzz*

[PumpkinSmasher]

I though we were going to have a level in which you can warp to anyone's wad,thus having the possibility of an infinite number of maps.plus with legacy you can go past map32, so we could just set a deadline and anyone who has a map in by the deadline will have their map included in the wad.

[General Greivous]

I'm surprised anyone even considers using Legacy at this point. Doomsday would probably be the better idea, IMO. You can do the same thing with a hub map that lets you warp to someone's map in Doomsday, too.

[ace]

Why Doomsday though? With Legacy we can get 3D floors, water, scripting, etc. With Doomsday, we would get models and hi-res textures. I know that not many here other than Dani and Sitters model. Otherwise, it would just be normal levels with eye-candy.

Of course I am not in anyway saying that Doomsday is not bad; I am just saying that feature-wise (and gameplay-wise) there is not much more to it than graphics. But the work it would take to make models and such would be overwhelming for a NewDoom community wad, as AFAICT there are not many here who would have the time (or the ability for that matter) to make new models and such.

And even in that case, we probably wouldn't need models at all because the regular Doom monsers are fine and changing them wouldn't be good. So really, aside from hi-res textures there would be no point in having a Doomsday one, at least not any time soon, as it doesn't have the FUNCTIONAL features of Legacy. And even if it did, I still wouldn't be enthusiastic about it because what would we have Doomsday-specific at that point? Models again, and we wouldn't need new monster ones so it would boil down quickly to nothing but hi-res textures, which aren't really necessary even if they look nice.

As for why "considering using Legacy at this point" thing, is that the "Oh, Legacy is old, Legacy is dead" thing? Because I'm pretty sure Legacy isn't.





Getting back on topic though, I'm all for a Legacy community project. I would even be bothered to learn FS because of it methinks! :D

As for the anyone can enter thing when we have no limit but rather a due date, PS, I think that the problem with that would be that if not enough people decided to join, it wouldn't have enough maps, if too many joined, it would become overly long, and if too many wanted to join in the middle of progress, then it could become chaotic because they'd have to learn all the rules, etc. While I personally find that a limit is good, however, it could work out perhaps.

[PumpkinSmasher]

Well the deadline would be set based on the initial popularity of the people wanting to help. And It could be adjusted if a few join late and need an extra week with their map. And we could keep the rules in the first post of a sticky thread, and edit them as necessary, that would keep them availiable for everyone. And if we could always stop accepting participants if we get a bunch.

[Flame Spawn]

I guess I gotta learn some FS if I want to make a map eh? *dark*

[ace]

Well the deadline would be set based on the initial popularity of the people wanting to help. And It could be adjusted if a few join late and need an extra week with their map. And we could keep the rules in the first post of a sticky thread, and edit them as necessary, that would keep them availiable for everyone. And if we could always stop accepting participants if we get a bunch.

True... that could be worked out then.

I guess I gotta learn some FS if I want to make a map eh? *dark*

I would think that at a minimum, probably at least an opening message saying "Welcome to Map X by Mapper Y. Of course I'm sure there could be a couple people adding that in themselves if one could not possibly learn to do that. But then again in that case we'd have to have it based on an honor system... :/

[Flame Spawn]

Ehh I'll probably skip this one. I'm just getting into GZDoom. Maybe, if we don't start for a long while, I'll learn some FS and join in.

[DooMAD]

I would think that at a minimum, probably at least an opening message saying "Welcome to Map X by Mapper Y.
Errm... not really my idea of what people should be doing with FS. Some people find that sort of thing annoying, or at the least, unnecessary.

I guess I gotta learn some FS if I want to make a map eh?
You don't really need to learn either. You can make a perfectly decent map without scripting. On another note, 2.0 will also support ACS as part of it's Hexen compatibility, so if you did want to learn scriptting, you can learn either one.

... is that the "Oh, Legacy is old, Legacy is dead" thing? Because I'm pretty sure Legacy isn't.
The upcoming Doom Legacy Wiki (http://forums.newdoom.com/showthread.php?t=29065) will make certain of that. We'll now be able to keep updated documentation and tutorials on all the features Legacy supports. It should be ready soon.

[Flame Spawn]

On another note, 2.0 will also support ACS as part of it's Hexen compatibility

Cool! I'm good at ACS anyway.

[Doom_Dude]

I have 2 Legacy projects to finish before I do any other side projects... so I'll be off doing that stuff when we get the NDCP done, not to mention my megawad.

Tho I stopped work on Stalking Evil because I was hoping to get slopes sometime. Meh.

[FATAL]

Errm... not really my idea of what people should be doing with FS. Some people find that sort of thing annoying, or at the least, unnecessary.
Including me. Unless it has some important information, such as tips or other clues.

[Aliotroph?]

Yes, exactly. I wish the ZDoom people would do that less. I don't like getting dropped in the game and then having to watch those credits every time I respawn!

[PumpkinSmasher]

maybe put it up in the console, so the player can read it if they want, but it won't be in the middle of the screen.

[ace]

I don't mind it too much, though I admit I suppose it could be an annoyance if it's a map where you're likely to die several times (though I'm a bloody cheater and use quicksave so I don't respawn at the beginning :p).

In that case though, perhaps we could just do it the old fashioned way and have someone make graphics for the intermission screen that says "Map X" and then under that have "by Mapper Y"? It could even be as simple as rearranging the CWILVxx letters and perhaps recoloring them.

[rustyslacker]

I like ace's idea. Where it says, "ENTERING MAP##", it could say, "ENTERING 'map title' by 'mapper name'" and could be tweaked to stay on the screen for a longer time. Not much longer, though.

[Aliotroph?]

And I think anyone who likes your map enough will look in the text and figure out who made it. If they don't care, they shouldn't have to get distracted by messages every time. :p

[ace]

And I think anyone who likes your map enough will look in the text and figure out who made it. If they don't care, they shouldn't have to get distracted by messages every time. :p

Well they wouldn't have to be distracted if it were in the intermission. *wacky*

[rustyslacker]

I don't know if I'll be able to help a lot with this project. I know I said I would help ace run the whole thing, but now I'm involved with Total Chaos, I might be joining the NewDoom review team, plus I have the UAC Waste Facility to finish. :( But all that might be done by the time you finish NDCP 1.:p

[ace]

I don't know if I'll be able to help a lot with this project. I know I said I would help ace run the whole thing, but now I'm involved with Total Chaos, I might be joining the NewDoom review team, plus I have the UAC Waste Facility to finish. :( But all that might be done by the time you finish NDCP 1.:p

OMG O MGO MOG OMG EGG you posted at the same time as me! :p

...

Anyway, when did you ever say that? Gah I don't remember things... if you hadn't said it then I wouldn't have to legally bind you to an inescapable contract that says you help lead or you DIE. :p

[Nuxius]

Maybe you could make it both Legacy and GZDoom compatible?

[FATAL]

Don't Legacy and GZDoom use different methods for creating 3d bridges?

[Aliotroph?]

GZDoom is intentionally compatible with Legacy in that sense. It even borrows some Legacy FS code.

lol Borrowing Legacy code sounds kinda bad in programmer terms. :D

[FATAL]

Doesn't "borrowing" usually include "returning"?

[rustyslacker]

It's borrowing without returning. Stealing, if you will. :p

[PumpkinSmasher]

Well that is unless the Legacy team allowed Gzdoom to use it, then its more of a gift.

[iori]

News Flash: Fragglescript wasn't developed by the legacy team - they don't own the code. However, the authors who made changes and added code to the current version of FS aren't credited in Gzdoom, which is annoying.

[Danimetal]

Wasn´t Fraggle the one who did it?... I think that Eternity has also FS support and well, GZdoom seems to have reworked it since Graf said "The current implementation of FS is a mess"... Speaking of other things, I don´t like that new term, "Legacy compatible" at all.

[ace]

Wasn´t Fraggle the one who did it?...

Well that certainly would explain the name, now wouldn't it? :p

[DooMAD]

Wasn´t Fraggle the one who did it?
Yes:
http://doom.wikicities.com/wiki/FraggleScript

[g6672D]

What Doom platform does NDCP run on? Or is it generic?

Ooooh I can't wait to see this... The suspense is killing me... :)

[ace]

Any limit-removing port (for the bijillionth time). :p

[Aliotroph?]

But not any limit-removing port that's GL only, in cases where the GL renderer screws up all the editing hacks we used. :D So JDoom and Legacy in GL mode are now questionable. :p

[iori]

Agreed, my latest map segfaults jdoom, and I don't have the time nor the want to figure out why, especially as it works with everything else (even legacy, in SW mode).

[g6672D]

But not any limit-removing port that's GL only, in cases where the GL renderer screws up all the editing hacks we used. So JDoom and Legacy in GL mode are now questionable.

NO LEGACY COMPATABILITY?! NOOOOOO!!! *cry*

Ah what the hell... I'll still use Legacy. I'm used to seeing mistakes in levels. :D

[iori]

Meaning that it can potentially be played with legacy, but it's only officially supporting doom compatible software mode ports.

[FATAL]

...

Crap.


I really don't care for software mode these days.

[Aliotroph?]

For some maps I find software mode looks better. There are casses where it's like a cheap version of Valve's "high dynamic range" hack, recently added to the Source engine.

Iori's map uses some clever 3D bridge type stuff that just doesn't work in Legacy's GL mode. That software trick where you can have different light levels for floor and ceiling doesn't work in Legacy either. Any map using it probably gets a nice flickery HOM! :p

The funny thing is I designed my map's look before I knew about most of these tricks and with Legacy in mind. That means it looks better in GL because I was careful about where I played my lamps. It looks much better in JDoom though because of all the glowing panels. :D

[Doom_Dude]

I never use software mode and Legacy's GL renderer is how many years olde? Anyhow I just run levels in Doomsday or ZDoomGL and if something is borked, then that's the way it goes. meh.

That means it looks better in GL because I was careful about where I played my lamps.
Alio? how do you play the lamps? :D Like the pipe piper of Doom Alio lead the demons into the crusher while playing the lamps of Doom. ;)

[Aliotroph?]

You mean you've never played a lamp? Man, you lead a bleak life. ;) *makes beautiful music on a 25 watt compact fluorescent bulb*

[ace]

Lawl. :D

But straying not-too-far-off-topic, what are Legacy's limits compared to D(2).exe? I map ZDoom alot and am afraid of overloading it, hehe.

[Doom_Dude]

You mean you've never played a lamp? Man, you lead a bleak life. ;) *makes beautiful music on a 25 watt compact fluorescent bulb* I thought you played those floor lamps. Oh well, my life sucks now. :p

[Aliotroph?]

Legacy is pretty hard to overload with a vanilla map. I wouldn't worry about it. It just barfs on tricks like fake 3D bridges and those lighting hacks based on removing upper/lower textures.

I didn't have a floor lamp in my room to play and I was too lazy to go downstairs. :p