Difinitive Doom Editing Manual [Archive]

Palladium

February 5th, 2003, 01:09 AM

I would Like to suggest a Difinitive Doom Editing Manual. a Complete and Unabridged resource for all information Doom. A Community or Group project.

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
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AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Aliotroph?

February 5th, 2003, 01:16 AM

Ah, you mean Rellik's site. http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/wink.gif

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"Once in a while a programmer really writes something he's proud of, a slick, elegant, blazingly fast routine that stands as a benchmark against which other code will be judged by. However, this is not the case with TED's fill routine. This slow, stupid algorithm will casually fill one plane of data in a painfully creeping manner. Press ESC when it gets confused." - John Romero on TED (Tile EDitor)

Aliotroph?.postCount++;

Exl

February 5th, 2003, 04:33 AM

Take the Ultimate DooM specs, update it, add editing info to it, add the Ultimate Doom FAQ, update and add info to it and dump that on a web host. That oughtta do it. http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/wink.gif

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http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/temp/sig_link.gif (http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/whacked)

One nut can ask more questions than ten wise men can answer.

Nickster

February 5th, 2003, 07:59 AM

Nah really, most tuts are pretty much outdated or just way to n00b friendly thease days.
*EDIT*
I could do some ddf tutorials, just put up a ask me or put up a request for something.

God-l-Send-l-Death

February 5th, 2003, 08:21 AM

Nickster, that DDF tutorial would be awesome....but not too n00b friendly and with advanced stuff wouldn't be a bad idea either http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/smilies/cwm1.gif

Btw Nickster.....I have an Edge question in the Editing forums.....would you mind if I asked you to take a look?

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I stalk, close in from above
Silent wings will test your faith
Death will never hear me pass
Pray for sin a shattered faith
Down on your knees, you're screaming out to die...

Rellik_jmd

February 5th, 2003, 09:06 AM

Any editing resource for many reasons MUST be very n00b friendly. Without new blood any community dies, and the easier we make life for them the more likely they are to stick around. Besides, if a person isn't a newbie they should be able to figure it out for themselves.

http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/wink.gif

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Member of Team DEIM (http://www.teamdeim.com/)
Webmaster The DOOM Editing Resource (http://www.teamdeim.com/der/)

Team Deim.com is TEMPORARILY down. It will be back, maybe in a week or two, but it will be back! DOOM Editing Resource temporary site. (http://www.telusplanet.net/public/daewoo/der/)

Nickster

February 5th, 2003, 11:23 AM

Edge DDF is very painfull to learn, I know it was so for me... I had to look through other tc's (Covert Ops demo and Qdoom demo).
Finaly they released the ddf docs and I could fully understand...
Heh, I hope meh ddf skills havent gone rusty... I used to know the whole DDF doc inside of my head http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/smile.gif
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade>Nickster, that DDF tutorial would be awesome....but not too n00b friendly and with advanced stuff wouldn't be a bad idea either<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yeah, I could also create some more advanced stuff like maybe dynamic lighting tut? Scripting? And maybe some of my unreleased ddf tricks (those which werent either fitting for gedoom or was just too requiring for gedoom standards)

XDelusion

February 5th, 2003, 11:32 AM

I have a GIANT book at home that I would consider to be just this. It is based on Wad Author, and is REALLY easy to follow. Only downside is that it does not cover Fraggle Script and the new Legacy features (I never touch any other port), and the fact that it does not support DeepSea, but I really can't complain about the book at all, it should have enough info in there that any newbie could pick up on Map building over night.

DarkWolf

February 5th, 2003, 12:49 PM

I can contribute my beginner's FS tutorial...

...when I write it.

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-DarkWolf
http://www.boomspeed.com/darkwolf/windeuchick.gif

Ninja_of_DooM

February 5th, 2003, 01:04 PM

They must be N00B (stupid term anyhoo) friendly. I found it hard enough as it was with all I had. I had to go back and forth to sites looking up how to build doors umpteen times a day just to remember. http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/biggrin.gif

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Member of the NewDooM megawad team. Map 14: Jail Break.

My own little bunch of WADs. Containing 3 individual maps. Download it here (http://sparky.suhost.com/pub/doom/ninja_of_doom_wads.zip)

Thanks to Sparky for the hosting.
If you would wish to host this then contact me at by E-mail. mailto:AndrewAFE@aol.comAndrewAFE@aol.com</A>

Hint to all Katana owners: Never sit on yours, It'll give you a very sore ass indeed.
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These are the four ways of man. DooM, DooM editing, DooM deathmatching and DooM communities.

mystic

February 5th, 2003, 02:26 PM

Im not sure but I think Thrasher (cybergeeker) is working on just such a thing in HTML using sprite graphics and stuff. But like Aliotroph? says, most of the stuff needed is at Team Deim, Thrasher also happens to be a member of Team Deim so thats the place to check.

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http://www.murray6.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/girls/avrilban.jpg

"One can't complain. I have my friends. Someone spoke to me only yesterday."
yahoo ID mysticandy13, MSN mysticandy@blueyonder.co.uk

Palladium

February 5th, 2003, 07:44 PM

Hmm... I was thinking along the line of an e-book broken into several sections.

*Tutorials
*Basic Demos, samples
*A Comprehensive database for all Functions, Calls, Lines, and Values.

It would cover the Usage of any and all editors that anyone uses, Dehack and Bex, Faggle and ACS, Doom Image Specs, Things and Linetypes(Including Port Specific). Anything and Everything related to Doom editing.

I was thinking along the lines of Something like the MSDN Help Manual, only better. I was also thinking of releasing it in CHM format(Microsift Compiled Help Manual) as well as HTML, Plain Text, and any format that anyone would be willing to convert it to. The GNU GFDL would be the License of choice, allowing the manual to be Redistributed, Printed, and have the Technical Information updated while Preserving the original writings of the author(s), and Allowing the Technical data to be transfered over.

Definitely based on Submissions from the community.

BEGIN LICENSE_TALK
There would need to be an invariant section for Contributors that says who all contributed what, but could be appended to so that anyone who adds to it later would get their name in the creds.
END LICENSE_TALK

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

TheDruid

February 5th, 2003, 08:49 PM

I would gladly help support this idea. I would be glad to design the webpage or post up the tutorials if you guys gave me a place ot host em.

====Legacy Member=====
Dark Druid

iori

February 6th, 2003, 12:07 PM

Yah this would be a great project! Count me in. I can do some fs stuff (not too advanced, cause im still learning lol but hey im game. I can also look into doing some newbie level making tuts, like the basics into more advanced stuff. I can also teach graphical stuff...hell just ask . i wanna work on this as i missed out on the community project http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/frown.gif

Ninja_of_DooM

February 6th, 2003, 12:12 PM

XDelusion, I would insist that you try using Legacy features in your WADs. I started early but I find them really easy to use. They're not as hard to get to grips with as you think. http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/wink.gif

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Member of the NewDooM megawad team. Map 14: Jail Break.

My own little bunch of WADs. Containing 3 individual maps. Download it here (http://sparky.suhost.com/pub/doom/ninja_of_doom_wads.zip)

Thanks to Sparky for the hosting.
If you would wish to host this then contact me at by E-mail. mailto:AndrewAFE@aol.comAndrewAFE@aol.com</A>

Hint to all Katana owners: Never sit on yours, It'll give you a very sore ass indeed.
------------------
These are the four ways of man. DooM, DooM editing, DooM deathmatching and DooM communities.

Nickster

February 6th, 2003, 12:52 PM

Meh, I dunno what you guys want me to write.
A basic tutorial how to do your first edge ddf weapon?
Shell ejection?
Scripting? (Advanced)
Level editing stuff?
etc http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/smilies/cwm13.gif

*edit*
Writing a quick tutorial on how to do your first weapon in edge...

Palladium

February 6th, 2003, 03:50 PM

Okay, If this is going to happen, Well need *EVERYTHING*. Post a reply saying what you will contribute and by when, then Well see where we are at.
A few Guidelines:
Use HTML. No Special Effects or fancy formatting. Use CSS whenever possible.

Keep the Images small in filesize.

Keep up to date as to what you can contribute and by when

Send all contribs to: Palladium46@earthlink.net

If someone else can do a Better job of Compiling this then I can, then Speak up.

Thankyou all

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Exl

February 7th, 2003, 10:09 AM

Maybe you could use a geberal CSS file, and also provide conversion to HTML for those people that are not so into writing HTML files (especially with CSS). Just a thought.

Maybe I can contribute with some dehacked stuff? Who knows http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/smile.gif

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http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/temp/sig_link.gif (http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/whacked)

One nut can ask more questions than ten wise men can answer.

Palladium

February 7th, 2003, 11:12 AM

Good Idea, EXL. Plain Text is welcome, and You dont need to use CSS if U dont know how. Lord knows thats high on my list of reading topics now.

For those of you using Plain text, use _Underline_ *Bold* and /italic/ style to Make it obvious what text is supposed to be formatted. no .doc format though.
those of you using HTML, Use a white background, and Dont colorize any text if you can avoid it. Plain black inside the and tags

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Nickster

February 7th, 2003, 02:45 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade>those of you using HTML, Use a white background, and Dont colorize any text if you can avoid it. Plain black inside the and tags<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade></BLOCKQUOTE>
Shesh, doest it really matter dude? Who made you the boss anyway? http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/smilies/cwm3.gif

Palladium

February 7th, 2003, 05:10 PM

the fact that noone else wants to be, and if Im gonna be the one compiling this thing I need to be able to do it efficiently.

You want to compile an entire Comprehensive manual then you set some guidlines and do it.

I dont care, Im just trying to make things easy to maintain and Format

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Rellik_jmd

February 7th, 2003, 06:22 PM

You want the manual to maintain a theme. If every person does it differently it'll look goofy.

------------------
Member of Team DEIM (http://www.teamdeim.com/)
Webmaster The DOOM Editing Resource (http://www.teamdeim.com/der/)

Team Deim.com is TEMPORARILY down. It will be back, maybe in a week or two, but it will be back! DOOM Editing Resource temporary site. (http://www.telusplanet.net/public/daewoo/der/)

Palladium

February 7th, 2003, 07:08 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade>
You want the manual to maintain a theme. If every person does it differently it'll look goofy.
<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade></BLOCKQUOTE>
Exactly!

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

iori

February 7th, 2003, 11:12 PM

yah....wel if im in then i dont know jack shit about style sheets so is it ok if i do it just text and someone can like paste it into a page or sumthing?

Palladium

February 8th, 2003, 12:40 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade>yah....wel if im in then i dont know jack shit about style sheets so is it ok if i do it just text and someone can like paste it into a page or sumthing?
<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade></BLOCKQUOTE>

Certainly. Just read the prior posts and we discussed this

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Nickster

February 8th, 2003, 04:29 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade>You want the manual to maintain a theme. If every person does it differently it'll look goofy.<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well, I didnt really plan on using mine for the manual, just for my page.

DarkWolf

February 8th, 2003, 07:31 AM

Let's write the damn tutorials before we bicker about what they're going to look like. You can always convert MS Word to HTML etc., it's not too difficult.

We need to have some sort of fact checking as well so we don't publish incorrect information.

The best way to attract people to this idea would be to make a small webpage outlining the idea. It would have to be an effort of the entire community, not just NewDoom.

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-DarkWolf
http://www.boomspeed.com/darkwolf/windeuchick.gif

FACE.UK

February 8th, 2003, 09:12 AM

This looks like it could be a fantastic project if it gets going. I wish you all luck and I'll be watching for developments to post up in the news section.

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http://www.newdoom.com/hosted/doomarena/faceicon1.gif

Nickster

February 8th, 2003, 09:33 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade>Let's write the damn tutorials before we bicker about what they're going to look like. You can always convert MS Word to HTML etc., it's not too difficult.<hr width="100%" size="1" noshade></BLOCKQUOTE>
Meh, sounds fine to me.

Exl

February 9th, 2003, 05:00 AM

I had some idea to make creating documentation a little bit easier. Everyone simply writes plain text files, using simple indications of what are headers, text styles, etc. *iwad* would be bold, and /eat me/ would be italic, to name an example. Later on, the entire project could be 'compiled' by a little program, which also immediately adds a glossary (using hyperlinks in the HTML documents it generates) and add proper formatting. That way, we can use a style-sheet for every document, not just a mish-mash of different lay-outs.

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http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/temp/sig_link.gif (http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/whacked)

One nut can ask more questions than ten wise men can answer.

Nickster

February 9th, 2003, 10:53 AM

Guys, just lets do SOMETHING, THEN we can start to think how it should look like. Its easy to convert everything anyway.

Palladium

February 9th, 2003, 12:47 PM

Here is an Idea. Tell me what you can write, Tell me what format it will be in, and If possible, when you can have it by.

Send it to my E-mail and Ill make a Little list of Whos writing what and Post it on my server.

My E-mail is: Palladium46@Earthlink.net

FACE.UK Added a tag to the end of it on the main page, so anybody who sent to that address I probably didnt get it

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Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Rellik_jmd

February 9th, 2003, 06:58 PM

Another thing you can do is each decide what area you want to work on, then write up the stuff in whatever way you want as long as it's fairly plain HTML. The bottom line is that even if the stuff is all differently styled i's better than no manual at all.

It'd be easy enough to specify a format too, and give everyone a basis. Considering that it's an informational guide it'd prolly be best to keep it simple: grey background, default font, no javascript, just nice and simple. Whether or not people use tables for anything shouldn't be too big an issue as long as make sure it works fine at any resolution. Pics too could be prefectly fine, though they'd probably have to be no more than 640x400.

It all depends on how much work you want to make for yourselves. If you aren't careful, you can over-complicate things and the project will become a nightmare. I've spent a huge amount of time on my editing site so believe me, I know. http://forums.newdoom.com/UBB/smile.gif

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Member of Team DEIM (http://www.teamdeim.com/)
Webmaster The DOOM Editing Resource (http://www.teamdeim.com/der/)

Team Deim.com is TEMPORARILY down. It will be back, maybe in a week or two, but it will be back! DOOM Editing Resource temporary site. (http://www.telusplanet.net/public/daewoo/der/)

iori

February 11th, 2003, 10:32 AM

basic levels wouldbe kinda tough to write because there are alot of editors out there

i know wadauthor and 'the deu's'.

Palladium

February 11th, 2003, 03:02 PM

then write them up and send them in. Usage manuals and Tutorials alike. and everyone else, tell me what your writing, then write it!

------------------
Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148

Exl

February 12th, 2003, 04:16 AM

Does technical documentation concerning the engine also classify for this project? I'd like to write a thing or two about the fileformats Doom uses (WAD, levels, flats, etc.).

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http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/temp/sig_link.gif (http://home.wanadoo.nl/dennis.meuwissen/whacked)

One nut can ask more questions than ten wise men can answer.

Palladium

February 12th, 2003, 09:09 AM

Most Certainly. How would anyone write a new Editor without that info!?

Write it up and send it in

------------------
Don't try to play doom. Instead, only try to realize that there is no doom, and it's you that is Played
------------------
AKA @Palladium, AKA @BfgWhore, AKA Many More
On AIM: Cyborphreek2
on MSM: elemental_palladium@hotmail.com
on YIM: Cyborphreek
on ICQ: 102670148